Out of the Lab, Into Their Hands: Empowering Consumers with Proov | EP. #189

Amy Beckley 00:03
And I realized the big medical gap where there was really no doctor to talk to. And this is such a common issue, and I would see women, couples turn to IVF over and over when they really didn't need it, or I felt like they could have done other things before going into IVF, so we started offering basically the solution.

Andrew Maff 01:14
Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of the E comm show. As usual. I'm your host, Andrew Maff, and today I am joined by the amazing Amy Beckley, who's the founder and CEO over at Proov. Amy, how are you doing? You ready for a good show?

Amy Beckley 01:26
Oh yeah, doing awesome. Now that I'm talking to you, of course.

Andrew Maff 01:30
Thank you. I'm so excited to have you on the show. Very interesting product line. Oddly enough, I've had conversations about this like dozens of times over the past like couple months. So very excited to get into this and learn a lot more about it, but I always like to start these off kind of stereotypically and give you the floor and just tell us a little bit about your background, how you got started with proov, and then we'll take it from there.

Amy Beckley 01:51
Yeah, absolutely. So my name is Amy, and I have a PhD in pharmacology, so I'm a definite science nerd. Always lived in the lab, and really want to know everything I could know about science and biology and all that fun things. And then I got married and bought a house and got a dog and wanted to start my family and realized how little I knew about my own body. Even as a scientist, we struggled to conceive for years. We ended up having multiple miscarriages, seven, to be exact, went through two rounds of IVF, which is very expensive. And come to find out that it was very, very simple hormone imbalance, that if we have the right tools and education for women for couples, that it could have saved so much so my first child, two rounds of IVF, $40,000 my second child, $10 generic prescription, natural intercourse. And that's like the change. And so I was like, people need to know about this. We need to, like, educate women and provide tools to help people understand because we're just not taught this in school. There is no good kind of doctor you can go to to talk about this kind of things. So I created a company and provide diagnostics to help women conceive, couples conceive.

Andrew Maff 03:12
Beautiful the so the product line, is it mostly on the testing side, or is it a mix of like, because I know that's on the testing side, but is it also on the Okay, here are your results. So here's what you should take kind of thing, like, what's the I know there's only there's legalities behind what you can do there, but what's Tell me a little about that?

Amy Beckley 03:31
Yeah, absolutely. So I started the company years ago. It was just a test. I'm like, Oh, that's great. All we need to do is test and they'll find the issues. They'll go to the doctors, the doctor will fix it. And I realized the big medical gap where there was really no doctor to talk to. And this is such a common issue, and I would see women couples turn to IVF over and over when they really didn't need it, or I felt like they could have done other things before going into IVF. So we started offering basically the solution. So we work with doctors who can prescribe fertility medications based off of their test results. We also have supplements. We realize that the women are deficient in this hormone called progesterone, and most women are deficient. 50 to 60% of women are deficient, especially when you hit 35 and over, and that's kind of what we're seeing. Is women are waiting longer to conceive because we're building careers, building our bank accounts, like, you know, getting all the ducks in a row like, and then we're 35-36 before we're starting, you know, to build our family. And at that point, your hormones are declining. And so what can we do to help women, educate them about this hormone, support this hormone, and just help them boost their chance of conceiving. So we have different kind of supplements or medical interventions depending on kind of which way they want to go.

Andrew Maff 04:53
Interesting, and so your background basically gave you the skill set to start creating these tests and then taking them to market, I assume,

Amy Beckley 05:01
Yeah, yep.

Andrew Maff 05:03
Interesting. So what was it like? Obviously, you've grown to a good size seven figure business. It's not anything anyone's gonna laugh at anymore. It's a good position. You're like, what was it like in the beginning? Because it's not a common thing, that there wasn't a lot of education around it, like you mentioned. And so if you're bringing something new to the market, and you've got to educate the consumer on this, like, how did you do that? Was there certain channels you leaned in on? Like, I know, and correct me. I'm wrong. The business is, the business is primarily e commerce, correct?

Amy Beckley 05:36
Yes, yeah, we're, like, almost 100% e commerce. We sell at CVS and Walgreens, but that's maybe like 3% three to 5% of our sales. The rest is ecomm. You know, I didn't know what hell I was doing. To be honest, I'm the scientist that lived in Kansas at the time, and had no idea just that I wanted to create this solution. So I did the only thing I knew how to do, which was to launch a crowdfunding campaign where it was like, here's what I want to invent. If you give me the money to invent it, I will invent it and give it to you. That was basically, you know, and I went to Facebook groups where there's these communities of women talking about troubles conceiving and tracking their cycle and all this, this. And I just said, Hey, I have this product. Do you want to, you know, come fund it, buy it. And that's kind of where we got our initial traction and our initial funding to kind of launch our prototypes. From there, we sold on Amazon. It was just almost like a out of the box solution, where all you had to do is take your inventory, slap an FBA label on it, stick it over there, and you didn't have to build a website. You didn't have to think about SEO or anything. It was like, kind of like a out of the box marketing platform, so to speak. Yeah.

Andrew Maff 06:52
And so that's where you started, on the Amazon. Sorry, started. Yeah, yeah. Interesting. So what point? Oh, wow. So what? What point did you realize? Like, okay, now we should venture into doing our own D2C side.

Amy Beckley 07:05
We did have a relationship with our consumer on Amazon. And when you're doing something as personal as fertility tracking and hormone tracking and as confusing as this, and there's no education, you you want to build a community. You want to build a support system, and that's what we were lacking. And people just got frustrated because they didn't understand the product. And it was like, well, just come to me, and I will tell you, and we'll go through this. And then, you know, we started launching or selling on our own website, and we were able to do that. We were able to sell, you know, send them information and videos and educational things through email. Eventually we launched into an app. So the app now reads the test records, it adds additional information, and so we've just been able to build a better product and a better consumer experience by moving as much of it as possible off of Amazon and into our own D2C site

Andrew Maff 08:01
Do you do anything like, in terms of, I guess, like community building and keeping conversation going amongst the community like, I know, especially in scenarios like this, like I had mentioned, I had a friend of mine, they went years trying to conceive similar issues. I have. My wife's got a couple friends that are having the same problem right now. My sister's got a friend. Got a friend's got to, like, it's all I feel like I've been told for the past, like, several months, and I know that they're all very frustrated. And, you know, it's very expensive, to your point, to go through all those tests and to go through IVF, and, you know, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, you know, do it again, like it's a process. And I can imagine how frustrating is, which usually means, like, there's a community that kind of wants to help each other work through those things and give them insight into like, Hey, here's what worked for me and things like that. Do you do anything to kind of keep them all in one area?

Amy Beckley 08:55
Yeah, Yeah. We have a Facebook community where people can go and, hey, this is my test results. Or I have this question or that question, and we have employees in there that are moderating and helping support the product and answer questions. So it's not like my question went off into nowhere and nobody answered it. But yeah, it's not something that people normally want to talk about. I mean, people feel very ashamed at inability to conceive that they don't want to talk to the people that are closest to them, as they would rather confine in, or have a community where people don't know who they are, and they can kind of be more open about it. I think the people that don't want to do that, they tend to think like, oh, I'm going to try by myself, and then I'm gonna go do IVF, and that's like, the only options I have, and that's what we kind of want to break through. And so I love the fact that your friends and family are talking about this, that they're telling you that they're struggling. That's like this first step, where it's like, first step is admitting you have a problem, and then you can get resources and can. Community support, because typical health, health insurance, health care, just basically says try by yourself when you're at that point of desperation, will drain your bank account with this thing called IVF. It is very frustrating when you know 50% of couples that go to IVF don't need IVF. That's a crazy stat. I mean, we're just, jeez, so many other things that we can do

Andrew Maff 10:25
That's a crazy statistic, and that is very sad, so also with that. So one of the things that, I guess, this kind of positions you in is kind of that more like, I guess, you would refer to as a consumer healthcare versus, like, your traditional healthcare. Like, I know consumers are kind of taking a lot more action than they used to years and years ago. Is that kind of where you see the industry going? How do you what's your thoughts on that.

Amy Beckley 10:53
Yeah, I mean, we're a medical device. We're FDA, cleared, clear, waived. Like, we could have gone straight to doctors offices and been like, this is a medical test. Let's get it, you know, billed under insurance, all that stuff. But the problem was, women don't have access to those positions, and it's like, how is this going to move society forward? And so we went the direct to consumer route, which is consumer health care. Now it's completely cash pay. Insurance doesn't cover it. It's like, you have to pay for it yourself. And it's kind of a hard thing to do, but I think that's the right thing to do. I mean, consumers have to be educated about themselves in order to get the right treatment. It's not healthcare anymore. It's consumer facing healthcare. I mean, you see all these GLP1s, you see that ro the hims and hers like people want healthcare to come to them, they're paying out of pocket to get a better, quicker service than basically going to a doctor that they don't know what their background is, their education, what they would do, and potentially being turned away or put on a six month waiting list or being told, Hey, your only option is IVF. People aren't they're not, like, settling for stuff like that. They're like, No, I'm gonna figure it out myself. I'm gonna advocate. And I always say, you know, to have the best healthcare experience, you've got to know yourself. You've got to advocate. You've got to have knowledge. Because if you go in there and you know nothing, you're relying on them to tell you, and they might not have had the right background and education. I mean, there's so much science and there's so much stuff to learn. It's a single human, right? We put so much weight and pressure on doctors, but they are humans.

Andrew Maff 12:35
Yeah, very good point. The one of the things I'm interested in, because it's always, it's my background, so it's always what I end up asking questions on the marketing side, how do you market this? What channels are you using? What's the messaging? Because I know it's a sensitive topic, so it's, you know, those are always very interesting in terms of messaging, like, what's what has been that approach so far?

Amy Beckley 12:58
Yeah, so we use the big one. So we use Amazon, Google meta, although not so much meta anymore, because they change their policies that we are not allowed to track conversions on their platform. So who does health care can't track conversions and so, like, we'll let you track clicks. We're like, Okay,

Andrew Maff 13:21
Thanks, Zuck.

Amy Beckley 13:22
Yeah, yeah. But the messaging is really about, you know, conception takes, you know, a sperm and egg for them to meet and then implant in the uterus in order to conceive. And everybody's focusing on timing. They're using their, you know, their period tracker apps. They're using these fertile window monitors to time this intercourse they're missing. Do they even have eggs? Do their hormones balance? Do they have enough hormones to create that good uterine lining to support implantation? Like there's all this other stuff that's missing, that stuff that's missing, if we can monitor and correct that for you and optimize ovulation, that would prevent you from having to do fertility treatments, and that's kind of the messaging is, you know, did you know implantation is required for pregnancy? You know, track more than the fertile window. You're three times more likely to get pregnant than for women, track your entire cycle, not just the fertile window. And so we're kind of letting women know that it's not sufficient to just track when they're having intercourse, but there's so many other things they need to know about to have that, like, you know, that optimized chance of conception?

Andrew Maff 14:30
Yeah, there's a lot of, I mean, there's a lot of education that goes into it, right? Like, there's a ton of stuff we've already talked about so far, and you mentioned only a little bit of your business is going into retail. Are you thinking of leaning more into the retail side, or do you think that that level of education is kind of becoming a little bit of a barrier to entry?

Amy Beckley 14:51
Yeah, so we so I think the education is a barrier, and it's not a barrier to entry, it's a barrier to product satisfaction. So we have several products, and the one we sell at retail, we only sell at retail. And so if they go into retail and they pick up the box like they're learning everything they can, you know, at the shelf, whatever's in the box, whatever the app says, they struggle through the testing protocol. They don't understand it. They feel lost, and they just are so, so confused, whereas, if they were to buy it on our website or even on Amazon, you know, they read the listing, they read the reviews, they read all this stuff, they're more prepared to take the test and know what it means than the ones that just picked it up off the store. So it's just one of those products and it just takes a lot of education, and you almost need that education before you start to use a product. Otherwise you don't see the value or you don't understand it, and then if you don't understand the product, then why would you ever buy it again or find it helpful? So we actually see E commerce as the best channel for this product.

Andrew Maff 15:59
That makes sense, and that also explains why the Amazon side was a little bit of a struggle because of there's only so much you can educate on there as well. Are you still available on Amazon?

Amy Beckley 16:09
Yes, yeah. I mean, I wish I could get off the Amazon drug. But in the world of fertility testing, everybody will tell you they just want one cycle at a time, they are going to get pregnant that month. And I we really, really wish they get pregnant that month, but if not, they're waiting until the last possible moment to buy supplies for the next month. And when you do that, then you need the Prime shipping. So you need it there in a couple days, because you're going to start testing really, really soon the next cycle. And so just the Amazon fulfillment network has been extremely helpful in building the business. So we find other ways around it. Our testing requires the use of the app, and so the app you have to log in, we get you know. We can educate you. We can show you our Facebook community. We can connect you with the Customer Support Center, and so we're able to kind of pick them up. Be like, you're not here alone. If you have any questions, we'll get you through this. It's much better than just, like, here's some test strips that you take into your bathroom and like, you throw away.

Andrew Maff 17:13
Yeah, interesting. Have you looked at was it Amazon's MCF? And just let them handle fulfillment for everything, so that you can just do two day shipping across the board. I know sometimes, like price points, it doesn't make sense.

Amy Beckley 17:27
So MCF is not the same thing as prime. MCF is more like a 3PL in the pricing. Prime is its own beast. And you get, actually get much faster. So MCF is just normal, three, five day. And if you want, like, the faster shipping you pay the faster shipping, like you would at a 3PL.You don't get, like, prime rates. And I don't know why, the only thing I can think of is that they offset the the FBA costs with the memberships for the people ordering it as well as you know, for the pleasure of selling on Amazon, they get 15% of all my sales, and so there's that extra, like influx of money coming in, whereas, if you're selling on your D2C site, you don't, they don't see that extra revenue.

Andrew Maff 18:13
Yeah. Gotta love Amazon. Are you? Yeah, they did tell me about it. They so to your point, you know they're, they think they're gonna get pregnant right away, if they could awesome, but chances are, it's kind of an ongoing process for a little while. What happens post that, right? Like, are you, is there anything I know you mentioned you have some supplements, anything like that. But Do you do anything to, like, increase the lifetime value of that customer, or is it kind of more of like, Hey, we're here for you during this time of your life. And then, you know, we're glad we could help. Good luck with your new kid.

Amy Beckley 18:50
Yeah, yeah. So, I mean, we've been in the fertility space for a long time, and we started to realize that these hormone imbalances that were causing infertility are the same hormone imbalances that women have as they're going through perimenopause, or if they have symptoms of PCOS or endometriosis or anything else, as we kind of step back, we're like, okay, there's this finite period of time that women are trying to conceive, which you know they need us for. But how do you grow a bigger business and cater to more women, because 85% of women have a hormone issue, heavy periods, painful periods, PMS, endometriosis, PCOS, perimenopause, all these things affect women, and it's hormone driven, and there's no good way to understand your hormones to help you find the right solutions and have a healthy period and feel your best. And so we started, kind of, you know what? How else can we provide this service to women? And so we launched a test called empower, and what it's designed to do is for women over the age of 35 they can monitor hormones every week and see how they fluctuate. We map them to what optimal hormones are and what you know, what symptoms they have, and we just educate them like, Hey, you're having these hot flashes because you have no estrogen. Hey, you're waking up at 3am and having brain fog because your progesterone is in the toilet. And this is just education knowledge that they have where they can say, Oh, I don't have this and I have this symptom. Now, what can I do? Maybe I want hormone replacement. Maybe I want supplements to help my body make more progesterone. And so how do we kind of use this idea of imbalanced hormones to create a platform for all women to understand it? So that's kind of where we're headed in the future.

Andrew Maff 20:40
And it's very cool. I mean, if you think about over the past, like, I don't know how long, long been out now, but like, over five years, like, you get the wearable technology, which is now everyone's monitoring a lot more about their health than they used to. Then you have, like, the other end of the spectrum, which is, like, your functional medicine doctors that just have, they'll test you for everything under the sun and help you figure out different nutritional things and all that fun stuff. So, like, it's very interesting to see how to your point, like, consumer healthcare is really leaning in towards, like, everyone's getting more information and making their own decisions based off of being able to run these tests to figure out what's going on, because healthcare is so wildly expensive.

Amy Beckley 21:19
I mean, we have to, I mean, the number of people that have been like, gaslit or went to the wrong doctor, didn't have the right education, you know, people are just tired of feeling tired or not feeling well, and so the only thing they really have is, like, if I have to advocate, I have to track it myself, I have to kind of take that step forward. Otherwise it's just not gonna happen. I'm just gonna feel crappy, and people just don't want that.

Andrew Maff 21:46
Yeah. Amy, this was awesome and very enlightening. Super appreciate it. I don't want to take up any much more time. I know you're super busy. I'd love to give you the floor let everyone know where they can find out more about you, and, of course, more about Proov

Amy Beckley 22:01
Yeah, the best source of information is our website. So it's proovtest.com P, R, O, O, V, test.com definitely sign up for our emails. You get a free e book, either on the fertility side or the perimenopause side. And then we're also we're on Amazon. We're in Walgreens, CVS, which is the fertility kits. We're on Facebook. Proov test. We have a big user group, even if you want to learn about the products and ask questions without actually being a user yet, it's great place. We're on Instagram. Pillars are education empowerment. So always here to support women. And we actually have men, men stuff too. So we came to this realization that women are putting the blame on themselves, and it's like, oh, it's always me, I'm the one that has hormone issues, or I'm the one that has to control the timing or whatever. And men were just going off scot free, untested, when 30% of the time it's their problem, you know, and something going on with them. So we offer a hers and his kit that includes a male test that makes it, I dare to say, fun to get your fertility test, because it's a little microscope. You collect your sample at home, put on this little microscope. It shows you this video of the the littlesperm. Men love it. They become more compliant because they don't have to go to a dirty doctor's office and do what you know need to do to collect a sample. They can stay at home. They can watch this really cool video. And so it's just been a game changer that men are coming to the table and getting tested as well, because there's a lot of things men can do too. There's supplements, there's medications, low sperm. So there's this thing called Spermaggedon. I don't know if you've heard about this, no, but by the by 2027, there's supposed to be no more sperm in the world. Projecting is because the sperm rates, the concentrations, are decreasing at such a large rate that they follow this all the way down to zero, and it's like 2027 which is no, sorry, 2047 2047 sorry.

Andrew Maff 24:08
Still!

Amy Beckley 24:11
Yeah, I mean, that's like 20 years from now. It's like, yeah, and that's scary, you know? It's just, there's like microplastics, there's stress, there's older men conceiving now, just pollution, there's vaping, there's just all this bad stuff. It's not good for our fertility.

Andrew Maff 24:32
Jeez. Crazy, crazy, crazy, Amy. Thank you so much for joining us today. Really appreciate it. Of course, everyone that tuned in, thank you as well. Please make sure you do the usual thing, rate review, subscribe all that fun stuff, on whichever podcast platform you prefer, or head over to the Ecomm show.com to check out all of our previous episodes. But as usual, thank you for joining us. See you all next time. Have a good one!

Narrator 24:55
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