Are you wondering if free shipping is really a thing? Should you jack up your prices to offer free shipping? On this 86th episode of The E-Comm Show, not only will our host, and BlueTuskr CEO Andrew Maff will be talking about free shipping, but he'll also be sharing about how to manage a VA, how to leverage ClickFunnels, and how to keep up with your competitors in the world of digital marketing.
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FREE SHIPPING - A Myth or a Fact
CONNECT WITH OUR HOST: AndrewMaff.com | Twitter: @AndrewMaff | LinkedIn: @AndrewMaff
As a marketing expert with over 15 years of experience in e-commerce, Andrew Maffettone (Maff) has not only owned and managed multiple marketing companies in the e-commerce space but has also worked in-house at multiple online selling companies, driving brands to new heights.
With his knowledge of marketing and business strategy, love for staying ahead of the curve, and ability to execute effective marketing solutions, he created BlueTuskr, a team of specialized experts dedicated to the growth and success of e-commerce sellers.
Having someone who's so specific in one thing is really starting to hurt sellers. So I'm really starting to advocate for having more of not a generalist, but a specialist with a generalist kind of touch to it. Hey Everyone, this is Nezaar Akeel of Max Pro, Hi I'm Linda and I'm Paul, and we're Love and Pebbles.
Hi, this is Lopa Van Der Merch from RASA and you're listening to and you're listening and you are listening to The E-Comm Show. Welcome to The E-Comm Show, presented by BlueTuskr, the number one place to hear the inside scoop from other e-commerce experts, when they share their secrets on how they scaled their businesses and are now living the dream. Now, here's your host, Andrew Maff
I'm your host, Andrew Maffettone. And today I'm going to talk about free shipping. Is it a myth that you should do it? Or is it a fact? And it is a fact? Thank you for rate review, and subscribing, and I will see you all tomorrow. That is how I want to end this podcast. Yes, you should do it. Here's the thing, if you can offer free shipping, you should absolutely do it. If you have to jack up the price of your product but offer free shipping, you should still do it. If you're currently operating and you're not offering free shipping, and you're doing well. Then why would you do it? You're already fine. It comes down to every product, every business, every owner, every aspect is different. So you have to make a decision on your own. I hate the questions of like, well, what's the industry standard? Or, you know, my conversion rate is this and my click-through rate is this and what should it be? It should be better. It should always be better. I don't give a shit what your metric is. I don't care what the industry standard is. It should be better. It should always be improving. Always, always be in with ABA. Oh, no, that's always Abby. can't spell. Anyway, free shipping. So if you can, the benefits of free shipping are obvious, right? Minus the fact that you need to fight with Amazon because everyone thinks that they're not paying for shipping, they're actually already paying for shipping ahead of time because they're paying for their Prime membership. However, you get so much with a Prime membership now and Prime memberships really aren't that expensive compared to how much people actually buy on Amazon. But they are kind of sort of already paying for it. The other benefit, though, is that you have if you're running Google ads, you can put free shipping in your ad creative, you can put it in the shopping ads underneath your price you can put there, you can staple it everywhere, every time you do a discount, instead of 20% off everything you can jack up your prices, and go 20% off everything and free shipping. It still works that way. But there are different product lines, right, you can't really do big, big heavy stuff, furniture and things like that free shipping can be very difficult to do. Because taking the shipping price and putting that into the product line when your product is already several $100 or several $1,000. And now shipping is gonna cost another couple of $100. Putting that into the price could cost you a sale. So things like that you have to think about. But if you're competing with people on Amazon, or you're competing with people on even Wayfair you're doing furniture, in some cases, you have to look at what are your competitors doing. And are they able to get away with free shipping? Or are they not doing it. And if they are getting away with free shipping, how much more expensive is their product than yours? So just certain things like that. But the free shipping thing really to me comes down if I had to. If I had to pick one of today's if we said it's either a myth or a fact, I'm gonna go with it's a myth. It's a fact that you should look into it. And you should do it if you have the capability to do it. But it is a myth that you have to do it. There's a lot of shit actually, I just I bought something today that I paid shipping for. And I hate paying to ship, but I really wanted this. I just got a firepit for the outside because it's beautiful out. And I bought a Steelers Adirondack chair because I wanted one. And they had 60% off, which is something ridiculous but it wasn't free shipping. And it was probably fucking fanatics or some NFL shop or something like that, which is the same thing. But essentially what they did is instead of giving me free shipping, they did a ridiculously high discount where I went, oh shit, I should get this now because who knows when they're going to do this big of a discount again. And then they charged me shipping. Were what I ended up paying and shipping. If they had just given me free shipping. I would have gotten like, I don't know, like maybe 10 15% off or something like that. So they did it the company the opposite way, we're not gonna give you free shipping, but we're going to do a ridiculous discount. And there are certain companies that you can't do that if you're a luxury brand, and you're doing 60% off, fun fact, you're not a luxury brand, you're shit. You can't have a luxury brand name and do big discounts like that, because it just belittles your brand. They are the NFL shop or fanatics are basically whatever the hell they are the same thing. They can do whatever the hell they want because they almost own the market. So they decided, let's not do free shipping, let's charge shipping so that we don't have to eat this cost. And let's just do these massive discounts. So you can kind of look at it two ways do small discounts with free shipping, you can do big discounts with no free shipping, or you can do no free shipping, and just tell everyone to go back themselves and pay it. There are so many different ways. So it comes down to your product line, you have to do your research on what your competitors are doing. You have to do your research on what even similar companies are doing. And then of course, you have to do your research on where are your competitors selling it might not even be on their site, are they selling on Amazon? Because if they're on Amazon, and most people maybe go on Amazon to get it because I don't patient? SOPs, standard operating procedures. So these are a pain in the ass. They're such a hassle. If you do them correctly, they're a big pain in the ass. A lot of people ask me like, oh, when we do SOPs, why can't we just do a video? And you have to do more than a video because it's just not explaining. Let me let's backtrack. Okay, so if you don't know what an SOP is, an SOP is a standard operating procedure. This is essentially an extremely detailed in-depth write-up with videos and screenshots, we do it my way with screenshots and videos and, just a write-up of just exactly how you do something in your business. So e-commerce sellers, let's say you have a product launch that you do. And you always want your Amazon listing to certain look a certain way. And you want it to go up at a certain time you want an email to go out at a certain time you want your ads to be prepared and look at a certain way for a certain time. If you could actually explain if you think you could train an employee to do it, that means that you could train a VA to do it might not be a VA at, you know overseas for several bucks an hour, it could be someone who knows what they're doing. But if you're not doing it that often then why hire a full-time employee and pay all the extra expenses on that? So if you can actually video yourself doing something and you can walk someone through it, you can outsource it. And if you can make an SOP for something you absolutely should, it is the easiest way to scale your business. Every time you do something, every time you have a task, you should look at it and go, Okay, who can I give this to? How can I teach them how to do this SOPs are kind of where that comes in. So kind of explain how we do it here at Blue Tasker. And then, of course, how a lot of sellers we work with, I just kind of show them like, Hey, here's, here's how we do it. And then I kind of walk them through our process, and they'll implement it internally on their own. But so we use Asana as our project management system. And we use I think it's the business, I think it's called the business plan that they have. But essentially, it gives you the ability to do templates, it also gives you the ability to do forms within those templates of each. Basically, there's a project and you can make a template for that project. And then there's a form for each of those projects. And you can have someone fill out that form. And as soon as I submit it, it becomes a task within that project. And then now you have all that information. So if I have, you know, a client who wants us to launch a campaign, for a certain product line, we have a forum where it says you know, what's the product or you want, do you want to do a discount can attach your imagery here, like just everything that we need all that stuff, and then it all goes into this project. And then we take that project, and we you know, assign tasks to different people. And then it all goes out. And it makes life so much easier. And the big benefit of that template is that next time it happens if a client's like, oh, you know what I wanted to do this, we should have done this, or hey, we forgot to do this. I just have to go Oh, shit, I gotta remember that for next time. So all I do is I go back into the template into Asana, add it and the next time I can't forget because it's right there. To me, that's not an SOP, though, that's a project with an outline of a project of things that needs to be that I need to remember to get done. It's those individual tasks that are different. So one of the things that we do for all campaigns is document when did the campaign start? When did it end? What did the website do? What did the campaign do? What did the ads do? What are the conversion rate to like, Oh, we're gonna get all that data so that I know for the next campaign, I got to beat that? So what did we learn I got to compile all that stuff and a lot of it I like to manually grab just because I'm kind of nitpicky on like I like to see it and then take it myself. And obviously, I'm not going to do that myself. So what I've done is I've actually used a platform called process street. So process tree is specifically meant for SOPs where you basically create a checklist of do this, then do this, then do this. And every little tiny checklist thing that you have is, here's a video of it, here's a snapshot of the area that you need to be in, here's the stuff that you need to grab, here are the links of where you can find them. It's an extremely detailed walkthrough of this task. So basically, we take that, and each of the tasks within Asana for this project all have an SOP within them. So what happens is, I assign that task to a va, va opens it up and says, oh, there's a need to do a checklist and process street, they open up the checklist that goes to the process Street. And as they start going through each little step, they go, Okay, now I have to do this. Now I have to do this. And then it gets marked off every time they do something, as soon as they finish, I actually get an email. And we've rigged it now where I also get a Slack message. And it tells me that it's done. So essentially, I know when things are getting done, I know who did it. There are timestamps, so I know what time they did it, it's great for tracking too. So if you're outsourcing to a VA, but you're not using something like Upwork, you want to know how much time they're spending, that's a great way to do this as well. But the big benefit of SOPs that I find is everyone's end goal, right is to eventually sell their company and retire on a beach somewhere. Even if you want to run your company all the way until you're 90, eventually you're going to have to sell it or eventually you're going to hand it down to someone else, in which case they need to learn how to do the business. And having an SOP with an exact example of how to do something specifically means that it's like it's idiot proof, you can't you can't fuck it up. It's very simple. This means that basically, you built a library of assets, where if you decided one day, you know what, it's time for me to sell this company, you can take your project management system that is basically templated of the concept of what you need to do. And you can take Process Street, which is just a library of SOPs, and you can just hand them over to someone, and instead of them contracting you and locking you up for two years to train how to do shit, you can just give them that stuff and be like, Look, I'll stick around for three months to make sure that you guys know how to read. And then you can get out. It's a fantastic way to set that kind of stuff up. But it's a great way to scale because then you can outsource everything you can outsource as much as you need to. And you can just sit around and watch checklist notifications on Slack go off, which is basically what I'm doing right now. I'll watch sit here as I'm doing this podcast, I'll see like, Oh, good, so and so just finished that. So process treats Asana, that's our back. That's our tech stack of operations. And it's what a lot of our sellers have started us now too. So highly, highly recommend SOPs, especially for E-commerce sellers, because everything that you do is so repetitive. And it's so just like kind of mundane that at a certain point, you can actually just outsource a lot of that stuff. And most owners really should be spending their time doing more high-level tasks. So look into it, and check it out. That's what I have for today. I'm going to talk to you all about Click Funnels for E-commerce and what my opinion is on that versus Shopify. So I had someone on YouTube who asked us this question. And as soon as he asked us, I was like, Oh, that one's gonna be fun. I'm a big fan of Russell Brunson. His books are great. The content that he puts out is great. The dudes have fucking genius if you go and listen to his stuff about funnels and everything. And here, here's my opinion on it. Click Funnels is a fantastic platform for people who are selling a service or selling some kind of coaching or something like that, which still kind of goes as a service, or people who are selling like one product or maybe two or three and are doing some upsells in something. So if you're unfamiliar with Click Funnels, it's a ton of different templated funnels out there where it's essentially, you know, really squeeze a squeeze page typically like a giveaway of like, hey, download this for just your email. And then it's an upsell an upsell upsell kind of situation for the most work. That's layman's terms. And they're a lot of them are very, very long pages. And I've Russell ever listened to this, he knows damn well, that is true, where they're obnoxiously long pages, with so much copy that I would be shocked if anyone read all of it. I can't even believe someone wrote all of it. And then there are just endless testimonials and endless reviews. And I like that to a certain extent, but it can get so overwhelming that I find myself just scrolling and scrolling and scrolling to just finally get to why I even went to this page in the first place. Now they don't have to be made that way. You can make them significantly less you can limit the amount that you're putting in and there's clearly a method to the madness. There's a reason that they put that much copy there's a reason that they really push and really sell exactly what it is they're selling. But on the product side, there's, there's one big issue if you if you're expanding your product line if you want to test a product and you're brand new e-commerce seller, it might be the way to go. I think Clickfunnels is like $100 a month or something like that. And it just works as is there are really no apps or anything else additional that you need. Whereas for Shopify, it's only $30 a month. But there are, like 500 apps that you are usually suggested to download. And their themes are kind of like crap, to be honest, click funnels, there's a ton of templated funnels out there that you just take and rewrite yourself. Which is the same concept as the theme. But to me, they just look better. But the thing is, is that if you're selling multiple products, you're selling 1020 different products, and you're starting to build out a store and you're trying to really build out your E-commerce business. The problem is, there's no catalog, so you can't connect to Google Merchant Center or to the Facebook catalog, you can't connect to any catalog connection like that. So there's really no way to do any kind of dynamic ads if you're doing it that way. So it's really more of a landing page style approach now is click funnels complimentary to Shopify are a different story. If you are selling if it's a product launch type of page that you want to do. That's a different story that I like, if you're doing a solo product, and you're trying to do a big giveaway, but you don't really want to feature it on your website too much. Because maybe your website features relatively expensive products, you want to give this away at a high discount just to kind of get it moving, then it might belittle the way the brand looks there are a couple of different ways and kind of depends on obviously the product line. But it can be good. I personally don't use it for the sellers that we work with. Just because once you kind of hit a certain size, you don't really need to do it that much. But if it does work well as a landing page. Now, I will also say though, the issue of having it being complimentary is you're now looking at okay, I sold if you want to run reports on how much of this product versus this product that I sell or something like that, you're working on two different platforms, you're working in two different areas, you have two different reports. And now you have to kind of aggregate everything, that becomes a bit of an issue. You can build out a Click Funnels style thing on Shopify, there's no reason you can't, you could obviously build out a giant squeeze page on Shopify, you can build out all the upsell pages, it's going to take you to a cart which will allow them to go back to your website to a certain extent. But at the same time, that's really not that big of a deal for them to see the rest of your product line if you wanted them to. And Shopify doesn't have the world's best upsell opportunities once someone has reached like the end of that cart where they're finally putting in their credit card. But there are a bunch of different apps and things out there that you can use. But I would say if you have an existing Shopify site, and you're still newer as a seller, adding on Click Funnels is great because of the reporting and things like that. It'll be easy. If you're a seller that's been around for a while and you have a Shopify site, I would say don't do it. If you are a brand new seller, and you are thinking about getting Shopify and you're thinking about doing your product, launch your product launch, I would say do Click Funnels first, because this will be a great way for you to do some market research to see how it works and see what's selling and then you would upgrade later to Shopify. That's my opinion. I think it's a great testing ground. I think that it's a nice area for sellers up to a certain size, but I think you can outgrow how marketing specialists aren't as necessary as they once were. So I want to give some insight into what it is I mean here, so I would say as soon as three or four years ago, and then all the way prior to that all of the channels that you would advertise on or that you would be doing any kind of branding on or any type of marketing really. They were all very separate. Right, you didn't really have much of an omnichannel approach you had Facebook was Facebook, you had Google was Google, you didn't really care about anything else around that you had printed, you had radio and it was kind of just how is each individual thing doing at a certain time. That has severely changed everything and has really become more of like this omnichannel experience where you know, Facebook is connected to Instagram. And now you're worried about attribution because of the people who are seeing it on Facebook but can easily go to Google and because everything's becoming so much easier. The whole process is becoming a lot more fluid where people can just do whatever they want. They can go wherever they go, and they can shop wherever they want to shop. And because of that, it's really causing marketing specialists will become less and less necessary. And I don't want to say have to revert to more of a generalist. But you have to have a very strong knowledge of multiple marketing strategies, no matter what to give an example, when I see a, let's say someone's looking to hire, and they're looking specifically for a PPC person, alright, they're looking for some kind of paid advertising manager. I hate seeing that kind of stuff when they're asking for, you know, the experience of five to 10 years of paid advertising and you've managed X budget, and you've done it for this type of industry and blah, blah. But they don't ask all the other questions like How much experience do you have in you know, conversion optimization on a website? How much experience do you have with email marketing, or with, let's say, social media or anything along those lines? And the reason I would want to know that kind of stuff is specifically for paid ads. And so I'm kind of using as an example if you have someone who's a specialist in paid ads, and that's all they know. And they keep driving a ton of traffic to a website, but they don't know anything about conversions. The issue is that they'll drive all this traffic, and they'll just sit back and go, it's not working, I can't figure out why they don't have the ability to go into the website and say, okay, conversion optimization, you know, best practices tell me that we need to tweak this, we need to do this, it needs to be mobile friendly, we need to do this, we need to have some kind of overall content strategy, we need to have some kind of tripwire like something along those lines. So having someone who specializes in one specific thing ends up hindering you because they don't have the ability to speak to why what they're doing may not be doing well enough. So sometimes, when we see agencies that specialize in specifically email marketing, it's great glad you guys are doing that. But if you don't have any kind of knowledge behind why you know, you're getting conversions, or why you may not be, and maybe the landing page they're sending them to is not good enough, it really ends up hurting not only the agency, but the seller that hires them as well, because the other problem is, you know, a seller can end up spending 1000s of dollars a month on an agency, and even higher sometimes, where they're just sitting there going, why aren't you guys getting it done? Why aren't you getting it done, and the agency is sitting there going, we're spinning our wheels, and we can't seem to figure out what the problem is because they don't have the knowledge of what the other marketing strategies are doing. Marketing is a completely omnichannel approach. Now you have, you know, people who are running ads on Facebook, and there's, it's just brand awareness because they know that they're gonna end up going to Google or going to Amazon or Walmart, or eBay or Jet or any of those other randomly think jets around anymore. But it's such a fluid approach in the way that people shop and the way that people are marketed to now that having someone who's such a specialist in one area becomes such a struggle because you really just don't have, they don't seem to have the ability to understand the overall strategy, they need to be able to look at an entire marketing plan and understand where they fit in. But unfortunately, that's usually not the case, unless they're in-house. And it might be a little bit easier. But that's really why I started to see that marketing specialists, although can be useful, are becoming less and less relevant, if they don't have some kind of other information, or are being directed by someone who has kind of a more overarching experience, who can kind of guide and tell people like, hey, paid ads guy, do this email marketing guy do this. And, you know, website designers do this just because they're able to kind of manipulate and move those puzzle pieces around. But just kind of an interesting thing. I've started to see it a lot with e-commerce sellers who are like, Okay, the first thing we want to hire is, you know, an Amazon ads guy, which is great, but then they have no idea how to do, you know, listing optimization, or they have no idea how to optimize a storefront, or they don't really know where traffic's coming from, but they're getting a ton of branded traffic and they don't realize that it's coming from social like having someone who's so specific in one thing is really starting to hurt sellers. So I'm really starting to advocate for having more, not a generalist, but a specialist with a generalist kind of touch to it. I, almost immediately after yesterday's episode got several questions about the project management system. So I figured I would do an entire episode kind of just touching on the project management system we use and how it can obviously be leveraged in E-commerce. So I had mentioned yesterday we use a sauna, and then we template a lot of stuff and everyone's like, well, what are you templating what does it do you have setup how have you set it up? Asana if you don't know is that He was, I can't remember who some kind of executive. So the owner, the guy who runs this on him, which by the way, they're going to IPO soon. And I highly suggest everyone hopped on that because there's not a lot of other project management software out there that is going to IPO anytime soon. But there is a guy who runs it. He was inside Facebook, and he created Asana, specifically for Facebook. And then he left Facebook to actually grow Asana himself, how he was able to do that without getting sued for whatever reasons. It's beyond me, but whatever. So we have, I think it's like 30-some-odd projects, where essentially the way that we've set it up the worst part and the best part about Asana is that is so customizable, that it's garbage in, garbage out. So if someone doesn't use it correctly, it fucks everything up. So you have to have procedures on how to do stuff. So it means you basically have to idiot-proof everything but what we do is I have a project for every type of strategy for the most part. So we have we want if we bring on a new client I want for Google ads. I want Bing I have one for ad roll. I have Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter, and tick-tock and then I have email newsletters and we have automated emails web design and web development, Amazon listings, and a plus content Amazon ads of course. Blogging, content creation, YouTube, admin stuff. Social management here, I'm sitting next to it. I will literally just read every single one of these so all my April's content Amazon ads, Amazon emails, Amazon listing optimization, Amazon storefront Amazon, and auto emails I'm gonna did being blog branding, campaigns, and case studies, that's not chatbots eBay ads, which I don't even know why we need one for that because they're stupid. email newsletters, Google ads, HubSpot stuff, product imagery, SEO, social ads, social management, website development, website, design, website audits, and some of that stuff is more agency related. But basically, what we did is we created a project for each of these things. And then there's like, it's got to be like 50, some odd tasks in everything. And every time I read an ebook, or I read an article, or some platform changes their stuff, or whatever, I go into that template, and I adjust it based on what I know, we need to do now. So when Google updated their algorithm over the summer, where they catered a lot more towards PageSpeed, and a lot more towards UX stuff, we were kind of already checking that stuff, we were doing a lot there. But what I added a little bit more on an article that I read about some good ideas, especially the web P images, which you don't know what that is go back a few episodes, I talked about it there. But I went into this template, and I basically added new tasks in there, like checking that all the images are this, doing minify CSS. Obviously, check out all tags, and blah, blah, blah, there was a ton of extra crap, it was you know, let's just clean that out. And so I adjusted there when Facebook recently stopped caring about having 20% text in their images, again, didn't really change too much for us, because I don't really like to do that. But we did have a note in there that said, do not under any circumstances use text more than 20% text in an image. I took that out and said try not to. So basically it's a, it's now I'm taking all of my knowledge, and my team is taking all their knowledge and stuff that they learned. And every time we learn something, go back to the project. And we just adjust the tasks accordingly. So whenever it gets replicated for the next client that comes in, now all of a sudden, it's very simple, and they have the newest best practices that we know fit. Then that's where Process Street and all that stuff ties into and if you missed yesterday's episode, go listen to that. So with e-commerce sellers, this is very, very simple, especially for the stupid repetitive stuff. To me, most of that comes down to support tickets, lit new listings, so new product launches, that stuff most of the time is very straightforward. So do this for keyword research. Then do this for the Amazon listing, do this for the product listing on the website, and do this for eBay. And this was Wayfair and then launch this ad and blah, blah, as all that stuff can basically be templated, and then once you launch that next product line you go okay, next time we got to remember to do this. And then after you kind of narrow it down, what we ended up doing is we kind of got it to most of it was really high level. So like first make the image then make this then make that then we got real deep like then make the image then it basically turned into make the image don't have the image with this, use this in his notes. So then it got even deeper and deeper and deeper where now it's just even the most minuscule thing of how to make a banner on a blog. rug, there's got to be like 12 or 15 best practices that we have for that kind of stuff now, where we just go back, and we are always constantly learning. And the worst part about if someone on your team learned something new, they should be sharing it with the rest of the team. But that's just not always the case. Because sometimes they might just go, Oh, that's interesting. But that's it, and they don't throw it into Slack. Or they don't throw it into an email or whatever it is that you're using. So now what we do is we go if you've learned something, and it's something that you go, I gotta remember to do that. If it's not in Asana, you didn't learn it, because that means that no one else in this office is learning it. So every time you learn something new, and you want it to be best practices, go ahead and put it back into Asana and everyone one issue that we've actually had, which I'm now getting on to a bit of a rant here, but it's turned into a good issue because you eventually learn how to get through this hurdle is that you've scaled the process so much and written out the process and put the SOPs in place, to a point where we've even had employees in the past are getting worried that the more information that they put into Asana, on stuff that they do and stuff that they know makes them obsolete. If you are bringing in someone in-house, they're not obsolete, they are a high-level, well-educated, very smart person who fits your culture perfectly. If they can make themselves completely useless and sit in the office that means that I can have them spending their entire time researching all new things, what's new What's something else we should be doing? What's something that we're already doing that we should be doing better? I don't want them actually doing the work I want it outsourced and that's where sauna and things like process three come into place. I'm gonna stop because I'm getting on a rant. So if you have any questions about this, shoot me an email at marketing firstname.lastname@example.org, and per usual rate, review, subscribe, tell your friends, your family, and all that fun stuff, but I will talk to you.
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